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Date Posted: Thursday August 09, 2001 10:11:10 AM
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What do companies really know about their employees and customers? Not much, according to Barry D. Libert.

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pcurran
Date Posted: Monday August 13, 2001 10:15:04 AM
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With respect, IMHO, this is (mostly) nonsense.


I do not want the company from which I buy some of my cereal to know my name, or anything else about me. I want them to sell me cereal, as cheaply, efficiently and effectively as reasonably possible, and then get out of my way.


Having a computer know my name is NOT the same as knowing my name, or knowing who I am, or knowing anything about me. Only the smallest companies can possibly know anything about their customer in anything but the most trivial, superficial way - a way that is more likely to be annoying and aggravating than pleasant. Efforts to "know" me are going to cost you a customer.


People are not fooled when companies try to pretend to be their friend. Using a machine to try to act all fuzzy will not bring or keep customers.


Once my daily newspaper was missing from my front step when I awoke. I called the publisher to complain, and after about six levels of voicemail, their computer apologized to me!! For about a minute I had to stand by the phone and listen while this poor machine, in heartfelt tones, explained how the company tries so hard to do things right, but sometimes it makes mistakes, and on and on. This did not make me feel better. Machines do not have emotions, are not grateful for my purchase, are not sorry for mistakes, etc., etc. All I wanted was to get a paper delivered, not listen to a load of simulated garbage.


Radio Shack takes my name and address almost every time I buy something there, to build their customer database. (I notice they have reduced this somewhat, lately.) I avoid shopping at Radio Shack, for this reason. When I do have to go there, for the few items hard to find elsewhere, I give a different fake address every time.


I never give my correct phone number to companies, unless there is some reason I want them to phone me. I only answer surveys when there is some benefit for me (not necessarily material), and even then I only provide honest answers to the questions that will facilitate that benefit. (Many companies know so much about me that they know I make less than $20,000/year, and have at least six kids. For some reason, those companies don't seem to send me much junk mail.)


I would bet that the current fad of "customer directed advertising," where companies try to collect information about targets to figure out which ads should go where, will prove of little value to anyone but the authors who write the books about it, and the companies that sell the software to pretend to do it. Collecting random bits and pieces of what I do on the internet, never mind what I do in the "real world," will never tell you enough about who I am to be meaningful or helpful. (Of course, I have cookie blockers in place, and never click on banner ads.)


Similarly with employees. I expect my boss, and others in the area where I work, to know something of who I am. However, again, in any but the smallest company, beyond the local level, a company cannot know its employees in anything but the most superficial sense. Creating databases to simulate real knowledge of people does nothing but create cynacism and distrust. Create a climate that encourages a manager to know his/her staff - but don't pretend that having lists in a machine is the same as realling knowing.


My life is not in the store, or the job. I want efficient, effective, polite service from a store, an HR department, or whatever, not a pretence of friendship.



 Message edited by: pcurran on Monday August 13, 2001 03:02:08 PM

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mamivores
Date Posted: Tuesday August 14, 2001 09:55:07 AM
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I agree the statement "... machines... pretending to be friends ..." or any incongruent behaviour is not acceptable in business.

What I disagree with is that only superficial info is all that customers want their vendors to know; at least in my field our customers want us to be able to provide some insights or coaching into how they do their work everyday. For the most part they won't get that info from us since we play a small part in their overall business procedures but since we touch most of these types of procedures, they care about what we have to say.

Here's what I see as a good balance: keep business/money making efforts out in the open, then shed that function and become a feedback (to your company) mechanism and where appropriate provide customers feedback where feasible.

It's not easy and always clear how this type of relationship works, but in the end the value that you bring is more substantial than merely being a vendor selling wares. The relationship portion becomes real/substantial when acting as a feedback mechanism you are able to provide "nice-to-have" items or artifacts back to the customer down the road. In essence at first a modicum of trust is given to the relationship and that amount either decrements or increments based on what you can provide that's of value back to the customer over and above the wares you give them (yes, usually just info, but that's sometimes very important).

Regards,

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pcurran
Date Posted: Friday August 17, 2001 10:30:14 AM
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I agree, but I think there is a significant difference between what you are saying and what the original article is saying.

First, simply providing good technical support is selling your product "as cheaply, efficiently and effectively as reasonably possible."

Second, when you go beyond that to meet your customers' individual needs more completely, it is because *you*, individually, know the customers *you* work with, know how much help they need, etc. This is, as I understand it, different from the original article's concept of the *company* knowing its customers.

Perhaps I am misunderstanding, but to me this suggests that salespeople and support people are interchangeable - just give them access to the customer database, and they'll know everything they need. To the extent that it is not possible for individual employees to work with specific customers, it is not possible to know customers.

IOW, people can know people - machines cannot. Machines can only record a very few selected facts, and (sometimes) make them available to people when they need them. Those few facts do not consitute "knowing" in any meaningful sense of the word.

I think we are saying the same thing here.

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mamivores
Date Posted: Friday August 17, 2001 10:38:32 AM
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I almost choked in laughter on the comment that Sales and Support people are interchangable... ) ... good point.

With respect to "systems" for capturing data/info about customers I also agree that a repository does not constitute knowledge. It behaves as a knowledge transfer point (as you mention, if shared among many), and is the basis for "getting to know" a customer. The individual effort of establishing rapport (relevant one at that) is what's makes stronger ties, not mere knowledge as you pointed out.

Good clarity, I agree.



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